THE ALPHABET BUSINESS CONCERN has noted that it is over thirty years since Cardiacs’ inception.
Throughout this tenure Cardiacs have struggled, with little success, to rationalise their existence for publications only too happy to take advantage of their in-eloquence. THE ALPHABET BUSINESS CONCERN firmly believes that music begins where words leave off and has, for that reason, only sanctioned a slim selection of interviews.
The views and opinions expressed in the following interviews are not that of THE ALPHABET BUSINESS CONCERN.
I
Harmonie Magazine. France May 2000
II
Margen Magazine Spain April 2001
III
Popular 1 Magazine Spain Jan 2005
IV
Rockbottom Magazine USA Feb 2005
V
Bite Me Magazine UK April 2005
Harmonie Magazine. France. May 2000
INTERVIEW: Tim Smith Harmonie Magazine. (Jean-Luc Putaux) France May 2000
1) Where does this amazing taste for chord modulation and unusual chord progressions come from ?
Musical background? I can’t think of any musician, whichever the style, who uses them so much. To this extent, it is nearly pathological, don’t you think? I don’t know what pathological means, Chord changes = goose bumps
2) Most of mainstream pop/rock music is based on the assumption that the listener can guess what the next chord will be. It’s generally not the case for Cardiacs songs. How do you compose? It’s as if you decided which chord not to use.
No, it’s not that. We wouldn’t deliberately not do anything. The chords and tunes we use sound pretty to us, certain key changes make your tummy go funny, the ones we use make our tummies go funny.
3) Did you have a formal music education or are you self-taught?
Self -taught
4) I was wondering if Cardiacs music was scored as the song structure and arrangements are often complex. How much are the songs mapped out in your head and formally arranged in the recording studio?
The songs that I come up with are thought up first in my head. I used to score it all out on reams and reams of paper like a twat, but nowadays I limit myself to one bit of paper just as reminders (as my memory is crap). Although one song on the ‘Guns’ album had me doing the ‘reams and reams of paper’ thing, it had to be done, there was no other way. I sat there for 36 hours solid and didn’t stop until it sort of brought itself to its end and when I looked back at it I wondered where the fuck it had come from because I couldn’t remember doing it. (in case you’re wondering which bit I’m on about its the long sort of dreamy bit at the end of ‘Jitterbug’ off ‘Guns’)
5) For me, you are an amazing progressive rock band but it seems that nobody knew that, especially prog fans and prog fanzines (with the exception of The Organ in England). Why?
Because we are not a progressive rock band, progressive rock bands usually tend to have a particular stile to them, however individual the bands sound is, there is usually a flavour there which is the prog flavour. We are a pop group.
6) In some songs, while the general feel is more pop, there is an intensity, a sense of bigness that recalls some big 70s prog rock names. Even though some listeners might be primarily sensitive to your punkish/pop attitude, I can’t help thinking that you listened to and liked bands like Yes or Gentle Giant. Which particular bands did you (or any other member of the band) like at the time? How did they influence you?
I’ve listened to bands like Gentle Giant and Yes as much as I’ve listened to music by just about anyone. If this interview were for a Country and Western magazine they would be asking me if I was influenced by Johnny Cash or whoever. As I have already said, we are a ‘pop’ group. We play pop music. We have a drum set and electric guitars and play very loud. It is however a kind of pop music that, apparently , is not very easily definable. Maybe the progressive flavour raises its strange head in the moments when we use great big church organs, or an occasional lump of Melotron or something, we use these instruments because they sound beautiful, not because ‘progressive’ bands have used them in the past, and as for ‘punky’, we play sometimes at stupidly fast speeds if the tune sounds better that way. We are as punky as nothing. God forbid if anyone thought that we were a crazy ‘fusion’ of punk and prog. If a word is needed then I would use “psychedelic” if anything.
7) Some artists are known to compress some objects to create sculptures (César was one of the famous french ones). It sometimes seems to me that a Cardiacs song is a big prog epic compressed into 3 minutes. Everything a band could put into 20 minutes is here but played fast and wild. Don’t you want to relax and let the music breath a little more?
I think it breathes at it’s own rate.
8) Cardiacs is certainly not known for writing ballads. Why is that? Too much caffeine?
If by ballad you mean a slow song, then there are some in there somewhere I think. Coffee gives me a tummy ache anyway.
9) I will list some influences that I detect in your songs. I’d like you to acknowledge (or deny) them and comment on them: circus / fairground music church music / boy choirs nursery rhymes musicals sailor songs mediaeval / traditional / chamber music The Beatles …
circus / fairground music…..we have used the sound of a kind of fairgroundy organ from time to time because the sound of it is so incredible if you get it to play a tune of your own liking. Within the visuals of the music it’s ridiculous if all of a sudden one of those mechanical things raises its ugly head and takes over for a moment… But I personally can’t stand the fucking circus and all its imagery. …church music / boy choirs….It’s some bloody instrument a church organ. Look at the size of the stone box they have to keep them in! I Love church organs. Any instrument is beautiful if it plays a tune that you like. …don’t get what you mean about boy choirs though…….boy choirs? …nursery rhymes……. can’t think of a nursery rhyme right now that I actually like myself… but I suppose that quite a few of our songs could be considered as being closer to fairy tales as anything else. …musicals……..apart from having a soft spot for the sound of many voices singing together in triumphant chorus, I cant think of one musical that I really like on a spiritual level. …sailor songs…….sailor songs? dunno really. However, anything that reminds me of the sea, however abstract (usually very abstract) is fine by me and when I say ‘the sea’ I’m not talking about the sea as we usually know and love, I’m talking of the feeling of the murky depths, all green… all spirits. …mediaeval / traditional / chamber music……I’m not really into any countries traditional music yet but I do find the sound of some mediaeval stuff to be very pretty, I like the squarky Krumhorns and buzzy recorders. ..cant see any relation to Cardiacs sound though. Probably in there somewhere…hiding. …The Beatles…….I’ve only ever in my whole life met one person who said he didn’t like The Beatles but I think he was just showing off.
10) Several fans admit to be addicted to Cardiacs music. Which elements would you say are responsible for that?
I think you’d have to ask them that.
11) The music is great fun but it is also very complex. Is it important for you that people might also see you as a “serious” composer?
I am a serious composer.
12) Are you the one playing the guitar solos? They are not so numerous but always very inspired. While you are all very skilled musicians, I would say that the production is more band oriented without much space for individual showing off.
The noise we make is for the greater good and the end result, we are not adept enough to show off successfully and it is because of this that psychological fines are placed on any members of Cardiacs, band or crew, if they are caught exhibiting any signs of vanity. Jon and myself are responsible for the ‘solos’ if you can call them that. Jon does the ones that sound like a thousand tiny birds pecking and pecking at an eye, while I am responsible for the ones that sound like a worm that can’t be stretched any longer.
13) For me, it is clear that Cardiacs is a band that either you love or you hate. For instance, on your official web site, many fans testified how they literally fell in love with the music. Would you mind citing some vicious criticisms the press might have invented?
The press in this country do not like us at all. This country is generally very paranoid about what music they think they should like, this is mainly to do with the music press ridiculing anything they think might put their jobs on the line if they admit to liking it themselves. It is safer for them to do this I guess, but it keeps the mainstream of music sounding very much like it is not the year 2000.
14) I can’t help but think that when you write a song, you already picture in your head people singing them during the concerts. The chorus are often very “sing-along”. How much do you anticipate the fans reaction?
We never anticipate any reaction from anyone.
15) The term “cult” might have been invented for Cardiacs. That means that whatever the commercial success, there will exist a very special relationship between the band and the fans. Anything to say about your fan?
From the stage they look like a pool of baby frogs.
16) We all know that one of the major impacts of punk and new wave music was to euthanize (?) prog rock dinosaurs. For about 10 years, the music was quite different, sometimes at the expense of musicianship and sophistication. However, in the early 80’s, some bands started to emerged in England such as Marillion, Twelfth Night, Pallas or Dagaband. At that time, did you feel you were closer to these so-called “neo” prog bands or to punk / new wave acts?
I think our music is twenty three billion miles away from the bands that you mention. I do not mean that with any disrespect to these bands whatsoever but as I said before, I do not see us as being a progressive rock band, we often use ‘odd’ structures and ‘time signatures’ in order to make the sound that we want, in my opinion, this doesn’t mean that we are instantly going to sound like a progressive rock band. In the early days of this sort of music emerging I don’t think it even had a name, bands were just known by their name and each band were unique in their own right. Gentle Giant certainly didn’t sound anything like Genesis who didn’t sound anything like Henry Cow who definitely didn’t sound anything like ELP etc etc. Each of these bands had their own totally new sound which was plucked out of the air from their own creativity, and each had their moments of genius (…and dodgeyness…but it was the fashion then, and anyone who has their moment of trendy-ness will pay for it later in life unless they enslave themselves to the ‘trend mongers’ for all eternity…) I suppose the term ‘progressive’ came about because the music was ‘progressing’ from what rock bands had been doing up until then, but these days when I hear the term ‘prog’, instead of it summoning up the image of something like Bowie’s ‘Man Who Sold The World’ era or whatever, instead it summonses up the image of a band doing long drawn-out corny chord progressions with some bloke singing about Lord of the fucking rings or whatever. “Progressive rock” has become a pigeon hole for a lot of bands that don’t necessarily belong there.
17) I read that you opened for Marillion in the mid-80’s. What was the reaction of the audience?
What do you think?…they totally despised us, Marrillion were a lovely bunch of boys though. We were taken off the tour for the last two dates by their tour manager because Marillion were getting so upset by the way their fans were treating us. They were going on stage as miserable as sin apparently. Poor sods.
18) Considering the success enjoyed by The Cure or XTC, I don’t understand why “In This Life” or “Manhoo” did not enjoy a huge success. They have everything to be big hits, just as “Signs” on the last album.
It’s the price we pay for our independence. Anyway, having a ‘hit’ rarely has anything to do with how good a song is.
19) Did you ever try to approach a major company to get a deal? What was the reaction?
We like our independence, it means we can do what we want….Sort of.
20) Is the fact that you had to struggle to keep the band alive responsible for the special raw energy of your playing style? If the band had been signed on a major label, would it change anything in the music? Would you record more albums?
A major company would not allow us to play the stuff we do, and if anything the ‘struggle’ drains our ‘raw energy’.
21) In the early 80’s Fish admitted that he painted is face to have Marillion make the cover of music journals (which they did with Sounds). In the early days, Cardiacs used to have a very trashy/childish/ghoulish image. Was it to attract attention? Don’t you think it might have had the opposite effect?
All we do is try to look our best.
22) I feel that I’ll need many years to have a slight idea about what your strange lyrics mean! For a newcomer, they seem very surrealistic, a bit like automatic writing. Where do you find your inspiration?
Up my arsehole
23) How do you feel onstage? How important are the concerts in the band’s life?
Touring is our holiday time
24) The context of the band is certainly a lot different nowadays than 15 years ago? What’s the main driving force to keep on creating music with Cardiacs? Do you believe there is any chance for a bigger success? Any project for a new album?
A new album is on the way, not sure yet when it will be finished, no idea how successful it will be, our success isn’t measured by how many ‘units’ we sell, its by how well we think the record has turned out and if the people who buy it like it or not. We obviously never set out to be commercially successful, in truth we are more successful than I thought we would ever be, and who doesn’t change over the course of so many years. Main driving force…? apart from the absolute love of all music and its attachments, it is without doubt the total complete and utter love for the people I have had the pleasure of doing all of this with. I shit you not. Bye xxx
Harmonie Magazine France May 2000
Margen Magazine (Spain) April 2001
INTERVIEW: Tim Smith
Tim, after 24 years playing music, do you think it’s time for a massive acknowledge of your work, or maybe you are confortable as a cult band?
We are totally a lot more than comfortable as a ‘cult’ band…it means we can do what we want, when we want, and we would not have it any other way… ‘cult’ just means “not very famous” anyway.
From my point of view, Cardiacs is “The Unqualifiable Band”, but if we have to look for a style for you, what about “the band which did a hybrid between punk and prog rock?
Sorry Luis Gonzalez but I’ve got to tell you that I really very very very much hate that comparison… It sums up a horrid image in my head…. Enjoying the occasional bit of sex pistols or the odd bit of Henry Cow or whatever doesn’t really qualify me as being a punk fan or a prog fan, I don’t know what I’m a fan of.
A lot of time has passed since we started playing tunes and we’ve always played what we play, ever since we were all about 14-15 years old, it is what it is, whatever the fuck that is….. I don’t know what it is…. obviously the question “can you define your music?” has been asked to us a billion times now… we’ve had over 20 years to think about it and we still haven’t bothered to come up with an answer…. to be honest we’ve never really tried, maybe life would have been a bit easier if we had….
I think we are a ‘pop’ group but apparently that isn’t it either…..yes, I’d definitely say pop….but the kind of pop that probably hasn’t been done that much ever in the world.
I’d say that the influence of Gentle Giant, Zappa, Devo, Foetus have been important for you? Are you OK with this opinion?
I don’t know what influences us really, I wouldn’t say that we are influenced by any actual bands in particular, I’ve got no bones about musically ripping someone else’s band off though…. I’ve definitely nicked bits and pieces here and there, I don’t mind if they don’t mind…. I remember working on one song we did a little while ago which was based just on the memory of a song I heard by someone else way back when I was about 14 years old, trouble was that it ended up quite similar to the original, I didn’t care, but the audacity of it raised a few wiggly eyebrows, the actual tune I wrote was totally different and all that… but the atmosphere was very similar, which pleased me as it was that which I was trying to rekindle…. I thought my memory of it had twisted the atmosphere into this new creature, but as it turned out my memory wasn’t that bad… but so what, tunes are for borrowing, you give them all back in the end.
‘Influences’ come more from random or abstract things… like I might walk past a radio playing something nice in somebodies window…. or I’ll hear a ghost in the bushes, or whatever, and I’ll think ‘oooh I’ll do a song like that’ but it’ll twist into something totally different in the end….but I do like DEVO and I think Jim Feotus and Zappa are genius and Gentle Giant have there moments of total unique brilliance (and moments of embarrassing grimness as well, like anyone unfortunately) but I can’t say that they influence us any more than a crow on a stump does.
Sing To God is your more known album. Do you think this is your best album?
No… I sort of like them all in one way or another….a funny thing is that the album our fans seem to dislike the most is one that I am very proud of…. the ‘Heaven Born And Ever Bright’ album which we did back in 1991…it’s got a really weird sound to it…I reckon all our albums sound completely different to each other anyway…unless you hate the stuff and then I suppose they will all sound exactly the same….and shit…and there’s an awful lot of people who share that opinion.
Are you running the label Alphabet Business Concern?
We’ve no idea who is running it, last time we dropped in to where we thought the placwe was, all we found were a load of tiny ants. (and a muddy puddle).
Why do you have published any songs without voice, such us the pirate album Oceanlandworld?
I don’t know what version of OCEANLANDWORLD you have heard, the one I’ve got has got singing all over it, I think somehow a copy of it got sneaked out ages before it was finished and all sounding crap and that. But it’s all finished and on release now…with singing all over it.
Your last line up is a typical rock quartet, but your music is very complex however. It’s true you don’t like to rehearsal?
Hate it. We do like the social aspect of it though, we rehearse maybe twice a year if that, and only if we really have to, like if we’ve got some live shows coming up or an album to do, trouble is we spend most of our rehearsal time at the pub if they let us in, we all been made to live bloody miles away from each other at the moment so we don’t see that much of each other nowadays… so we piddle around for half an hour or so ‘rehearsing’ if you can call it that…. get it all wrong… then go down the pub, get drunk under the excuse of ‘seeing if we can play the stuff arse-holed’ and if we can it must be ok…. trouble is… we’ve got an unhealthy belief that ‘it’ll be alright on the night’ and being totally honest, if it’s not alright on the night we really could not give much of a fuck. It is not laziness… I don’t know what it is….
I can never figure out how bands manage to write songs by ‘jamming’ I couldn’t think of a more horrible nightmare…. apart from the fact that we’d end up with compromised bollocks. It must give you an arm ache and get you really really bored and make all your eyes boil…don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that our musicianship is so fucking great that we don’t have to rehearse or anything because it is not (apart from Jon our guitarist), we’re just lucky because when we do get to play live, for some reason it all turns out fucking great…God knows how.
If you don’t mind me prattling on a bit I’ll tell you about this band I played in for a little while a few years ago called Panixphere, it was a sort of ‘side project’ that me and Jon Poole (our guitarist) and Bic and Dave francolini (from Dark Star and Levitation) did. What we’d do is write and meticulously rehearse this ridiculously complex and stupidly fast stuff with the sole intention of destroying it live. When we did a gig we’d get totally wasted and then barrage our way through the set in three tenths of a second…the end result was a brilliant fucking din based limply around what we’d worked out… there is no way it would have sounded the same if we hadn’t done it like that…but it cleaned our souls and didn’t last very long….what was I saying?
Between 1986 and 1989 you published 3 live albums. Do you plan any album live with the actual line-up? When will be available your new studio album? When another album by Sea Nymphs?
We only stuck them Live albums out to try and generate some money…a new studio album is well on it’s way and will be out later on this year…or maybe early next year…2002 is a nicer sounding date so maybe we’ll put it out then even if it is finished this year (which it will be)…
As for the Sea Nymphs, that band relies on an awful lot of superstition and whatever falling into place, I don’t want to release stuff by the Nymphs willy nilly….the album that came out in 1995 was actually recorded many years before that and the next one waiting to come out was recorded at the same time as the first…and the one to follow that was also recorded back then as well….and so on…I think the Sea Nymphs is special…I’ve no idea what happened when all that stuff was recorded…or how… It involved Witches and woods and snails and wires and a Hare at one point which looked me in the eye and then gave Sarah a penny and a photograph of a Pony.
The tapes are a bit corroded now…we retrieved them from the bottom of a pond that Sarah put them in to keep them safe under water until we needed them but some slime got in. My ‘other’ band Spratleys Japs are about to start another album soon…that’s another bloody story.
Sea Nymphs, Spratley’s Japs, Monsoon Bassoon, Katherine In A Cupboard, Dark Star, Lake Of Puppies, Sidi Bou Said, Shrubbies, Nervous, Does exist a “Cardiac community”?
Yes there is, it’s tendrils spread a lot further as well, a label has been set up for releasing albums by many of these elusive spreadlings…if anyone is interested check out this website www.anyware.co.uk/ame if it’s not up and running yet it will be soon. Or you can write to AME PO Box 1804 Salisbury Wiltshire SP5 5SY England.
How is your brother Jim?
I’ve no idea, he won’t tell me, last time I saw him he was trying to graft some moth wings onto the backs of his hands to make them softer because someone told him that his hands were all rough, the needle made his hands bleed, not in a good way, but in a pathetic way.
I asked to a British musicians whether your lyrics were ironic or poetic. He answered me: “The lyiric of these guys are deep and poetic”. Are you Ok with this opinion?
I don’t mind, but that’s all you’re getting out of me about lyrics.
Personally I think Cardiacs is the best band around the world and Sing To God the best album
Thank you
Tell me something about your experience with Rough Trade.
There wasn’t really an ‘experience’ with Rough Trade, they put an album out for us and immediately went broke, people do tend to think that we carry a curse, including us, I would strongly recommend that you think twice about including us on that CD that you release with your magazine.
Last question, dog or horse? which do you prefer?
I prefer Both.
(written by Luis Gonzalez)
Popular 1 Magazine Spain Jan 2005
INTERVIEW: Tim Smith and Kavus Torabi
As an introduction to the people that doesn’t know you, What is CARDIACS?
Tim
– Cardiacs is our life and everything we do, and everything we have ever done. We are getting old now. Quite old, but it’s everything we do, everything we have ever done since we were tiny. We play a kind of music that we are very very proud of and love more than life. A kind of music that apparently makes people hate us with a terrifying vengeance, or love us so dearly and passionately that it becomes a worry. No in-betweens. But to us it’s just tunes. Lovely tunes. Tunes are important in life.
Far beyond ‘rock prog-punk-pop’ nonsense labels, How do you DEFINE your music?
Tim
– You’d think we might have come up with an easy, understandable answer to that question by now, we’ve obviously been asked it so many times. It would be such a good idea to have an answer to it, it would help us, and it would help people reading this interview, but no. Can’t do it. Pop? Is it pop music? I think that might be it. Pop that no one else seems to have dreamed of yet.
Kavus
– I think the hardest thing for most musicians to do is define their music, not that we’re not aware of labels that get put on us, but when you’re playing or in particular writing stuff, your mind just doesn’t think that way. It’s funny because although we can be really slippery and try to wriggle out of categorising just-what-the-fuck-it-is-that-we-do, if someone does come up with some sort of suggestion as to “What this far out sound might be’ that’s slightly off the mark, I just think… “Christ, they don’t have a clue”, which is unfair because music is so subjective.
It sounds like it comes out of dreams sometimes. The music of Cardiacs seems to get right down into the guts of what this whole crazy life is about, while not actually seeming to be about anything.Tim and I were at a party a few years ago and this Scottish guy asked him, “you’re Tim Smith, no?” and then added, “Your music is BIG LIFE”. I think he pretty much had it nailed.
It has to be hard to rehearse such a complex music… How do you face REHEARSALS? Is that the reason why you only play a few shows every year?
Tim
– Rehearsals are just our excuse to have a big love-in. Have big fun. Then we have to practice playing tunes at some point. The music isn’t that tricky anyway. If we can play it then it can’t be.
Kavus
– For me this is the easiest band I’ve been in, not in terms of the complexity of the stuff necessarily, but rehearsals are such a joy. Everyone knows how great the stuff is, and, you know, it’s not really a question of fucking around with the tunes after they’ve been recorded… That’s how they go.
It’s a joy for me to be playing this stuff , being that Cardiacs was always my favourite band anyway. As for the “few shows every year” situation, circumstance has dictated the frequency of live shows for the last five years or so but we’ve turned a corner with that now. You should be seeing a lot more of us this year.
What’s the main INSPIRATION in your music and lyrics? Favourite bands and influences?
Tim
– Really don’t know what inspires me personally. Cups and saucers?…erm…big eggs? I like all sorts of music. Literally. If I like the tune that is. Fave bands? I got plenty of them, but I can’t say that any of them ‘influence’ me as such, but I’ll nick someone else’s idea at the drop of a hat if I like it. I have no shame.
Do you feel happy being a CULT band?
Tim
– I feel fine, thank you for asking. We can do what we want when we want. Cult just means ‘not very famous’ and if that equals being able to make the tunes of your choice then ‘cult’ is a good thing for us to be.
Kavus
– For me it’s not a problem….there’s always a bit of cool attached to being a cult band, not that I’m bothered about that, but all the groups I like tend to fall into that category. If being a cult band means you get to operate on your own terms without being told “I don’t hear any singles on this album” or “Not bad, but perhaps you could lose a couple of minutes off the end” then fine.
What is THE ALPHABET BUSINESS MUSIC CONCERN?
Tim
– I don’t really know.
Kavus
– I personally don’t have any dealings with them. Alphabet have not spoken to me once since I’ve joined. I wouldn’t go as far as calling them names, because it would be like biting the hand that feeds, except they don’t feed. So it’s more like glassing the eye that bleeds I suppose. I don’t know if they even like me or not. I’ve never met anyone involved. It’s a strange set up but it seems to work. Sort of.
I’ve read somewhere you are working on a NEW studio album (and maybe a new live album too), what can you tell me about it? What will be the vibe of the new record?
Tim
– yes we are working on a new album. It will be different to all the other albums but it will also be the same old shit. I think all our albums all have totally different vibes to each other while at the same time being, as I said, the same old shit. Our loyal fans always tend to moan about a new release until they get used to it. Then luckily they seem to come around and think it’s the best one yet. We’ll see what happens with the next one. We like it so far. If we didn’t then it wouldn’t get to see the light of day.
Kavus
– Yes we’re working on a new album, sort of like the old stuff but with more silver paint and a ray gun. I tell you what though, we did some gigs a year or so ago and only played material from ‘76- 81, about 35 songs in all, most of which was never recorded properly in those days and a lot of stuff that was never recorded at all. The point is, we recorded the gigs and they’ll be available through us as two live albums in March. But God man….they sound great.
I’d like to TIME TRAVEL to the origins of Cardiacs. How do you recall your first steps as Cardiac Arrest?
Tim
– We were babies. Tiny pink shitting screaming sicking babies. So like all babies my memory of such a time is very abstract. Best not mentioned really. But none of us were what you’d call ‘musicians’ really. We just shared a similar idea. Whatever that was. Whatever that still is.
Apart from you extraordinary music (that’s how I would catalogue it), you’ve been a band with an intense an unique appearance, specially in your first years, with those strange suits and the make-up. What can you tell me about that shocking LOOK?
Tim
– Thank you for calling us extraordinary. We were not aware that we looked strange back then. The strange suits and make up we wore in those days was us just trying to look our best. We read somewhere that pop groups were suppose to look their best so we were told to do it. Maybe we got it a bit wrong.
I still remember the Seaside Treats video as one of the most HYPNOTIZING experiences in my life, with those strange stories about The Consultants Flower Garden and those wicked clips? Again… what was on your mind while shooting those little films?
Tim
– I remember big eggs being on my mind. Most of the footage was shot while we were unaware. We didn’t know what a camera really was back then. We were told it was a machine that made you prettier than nature intended.
Kavus
– I remember the first time I saw it I was about 17, and Cardiacs was already my favourite band. I lived in a city in the South West of England and had never seen the band live, in fact the only picture I’d seen of them was the cover of Cardiacs Live. So I’d been banging on about this amazing group to anyone who’d listen, when a friend bought Seaside treats. I remember going around there to watch it and afterwards thinking “Oh Christ. What the fuck have I let myself in for with this lot…”
Hmmm… What about your personal ‘obsession’ about ANIMALS in your songs, specially dogs and horses?
Tim
– I wasn’t aware that I had one, but they do tend to crop up from time to time, you’re right. But I don’t know why.
I’d like to know your personal opinion about some of my fav Cardiacs MEMBERS of your past and present history:
Mr.TIM QUY
the amazing
WILLIAM D. DRAKE
your wife
SARAH
Sir
JON POOLE
and specially, your brother
JIM.
What about your ‘special relationship’?
Tim –
I love them all. They are my special family.
Let’s talk a little about three of my fav Cardiacs side PROJECTS… What can you tell me about…?
THE SEA NYMPHS
SPRATLEY’S JAPS
OCEANLANDWORLD
Tim
The Sea Nymphs was me Sarah and William. Sarah was Cardiacs sax player and William the keyboards player. We set up some old fashioned recording equipment in the woods in Winter time many years ago and recorded some songs that were covered in snails. I think it is a beautiful album. We got very wet during that time. We also recorded a whole lot more at that time that was never released. I think it will be some day now.
Spratleys Japs was a strange bunch of people I got to record an album with. It was written and produced by me and recorded in this weird old studio in the New Forest. The studio had lots of Rats in it and they watched us all the time. Sniffing and scratching, and the wires in the studio would gurgle and spit. I like this album very very very much. The ‘Oceanland’ album is just something I recorded on my own many years ago as a sort of punishment. I suppose it’s a ‘solo’ album, but it’s just songs. It’s in no way the kind of stuff that I felt HAD to be a solo project.
I would also love to know your opinion about some of your finest ALBUMS. Just a quick thought about it, if you don’t care.
BIG SHIP/TOO MANY IRONS EPs (later on “Songs for Ships and Irons” album)
A LITTLE MAN AND A HOUSE AND THE WHOLE WORLD WINDOW
ON LAND AND IN THE SEA
HEAVEN BORN AND EVER BRIGHT
SING TO GOD
GUNS
(If you had to choose just one, what would be your favourite one, Tim?)*
Tim
I like them all for their own reasons. Sorry. However, I will defend one of them as it wasn’t so well received when it popped out and that one is ‘Heaven Born And Ever Bright’. I think it came out exactly how it was intended to. A lot of people seem to think it was a bit of an accident. ‘Guns’ as well, I will defend that fucker to the muddy grave.
Now you’ve been on tour supporting THE WILDHEARTS. What can you tell me about the experience? Do you consider the possibility of working with Ginger or Jon Poole again?
Kavus
– We all loved the Wildhearts tour, It’s the first one I’ve done with the band as Guitarist rather than “stage artfulness” and for me it was certainly my favourite. I hope I’m not going to spoil The Wildhearts reputation when I say that the entire band and crew and their audiences were darlings. I didn’t want it to end. We went down pretty well…not just for a support band, their fans were genuinely shocked, baffled but also really into it as well. I loved watching The Wildhearts themselves, they’re like an oiled machine live, just always on top form, and Jon really fits in well with them. He’s like the New White Bald Rock Messiah or something. Jon came on and played Big Ship with us on the last night and Ginger joined us for the solo in Is This The Life which was a gem. It sounds corny, but we had to do it….a real rock comraderie moment.
Oh, and this is a very special one for me too: please, name some of your favorite FILMS AND BOOKS and give me (if you want) a quick impression about it.
Tim
– Kavus will think you meant rock albums when you said films because he’ll do that with anything because he always wants to talk about rock. If you asked him what his favourite eye was he’d talk about rock. Or his arm…again.
Kavus
– Here’s a few that spring to mind. Books: The Third Policeman-Flann O Brien, Franny and Zooey-JD Sallinger, Decline and Fall- Evelyn Waugh. If on a Winter’s Night a Traveller- Italo Calvino, Siddartha-Herman Hesse, 100 Years of Solitude- Gabriel Garcia Marquez. New York Trilogy-Paul Auster, A Prayer for Owen Meany- John Irving. The Outsider- Albert Camus, All Quiet on The Orient Express- Magnus Mills… …Albums: Leg End- Henry Cow, Speechless- Fred Frith… actually almost every record Frith’s been involved with…he’s like my Elvis. Pony Express Record- Shudder to Think. Song Cycle- Van Dyke Parks. Reign in Blood- Slayer. The first few Gong albums. Most XTC stuff. Torture Garden- Naked City. Dopesmoker/Jerusalem- Sleep. The first 8 Black Sabbath albums. Rise and Fall-Madness. The Marble Index- Nico. Anything by Magma or Mike Patton. Gluey Porch Treatments- Melvins. Nothingface- Voivod. Rock Bottom- Robert Wyatt. Loveless- My Bloody Valentine. Les Bucher Des Silences- Valentin Clastrier. Daydream Nation- Sonic Youth. The first Stray Cats album. Close to the Edge- Yes. Leave Home- Ramones. American Don-Don Caballero, An Electrical Storm-White Noise. Forever Changes- Love, Laughing Stock and Spirit of Eden by Talk Talk and Mark Hollis’ solo album. Chiastic Slide- Autechre….Is this getting boring yet? I could go on…I’m such a “fan”. Weasels Ripped My Flesh/Uncle Meat/ Burnt Weeny Sandwich- Zappa/Mothers. Frisbee- Heavy Vegetable, plus the two Thingy Albums. A Can of Bees- The Soft Boys and Beefheart’s Trout Mask Replica.
THANX AD INFINITUM!
Tim
– thank you very much
Kavus
– Thank you it’s been fun
All the best,
ALBERTO DIAZ (Popular1 Magazine. Barcelona, Spain)
Rockbottom Magazine USA Feb 2005
Interview with Kavus
For those who don’t know, Cardiacs have been going since…well…FOREVER, and yet they keep on defying music as we know it, with their brand of offbeat/pop/indie/rock/punk/beatnik-elitist shirt&tie wearing clever punishment. Cardiacs were making albums when you were a mere blink in the milkman’s eye. Oh yes. Anyway without further ado…here they are…The legendary Cardiacs……
1) If some cunt said to me…”MAKE A LIST OF WEIRDO BANDS, BEFORE I KICK YOUR FUCKING HEAD IN!!”….I would make a list like this;
Cardiacs
Devo
Punishment of Luxury (Their “Jellyfish” ep is AWESOME, man!!)
Cassiber
Egg
Henry Cow
Unit
The Locust
The Melvins
Sometimes accessible and most of the time …not (You know the drill) So explain to the American people (and world-wide readership) WHAT the fuck Cardiacs are on about…go on…try and classify your elitist ass.
Kavus Torabi
– Hi this is Kavus, I play guitar in them Cardiacs. Firstly it’s nice to be lumped in with those lovely bands, although I’ve never heard Egg or Unit. I don’t think we actually sound like any of ‘em, nor do I think of them as weirdo bands, particularly Henry Cow who I love too much to call anything.I’ve only been playing in Cardiacs a couple of years, but I’ve been a massive fan since I was 16. To my mind there’s nothing at all elitist about the music we make. You don’t have to “get” anything about it, nor does it require any previous knowledge of any genre or “scene”. It’s beautiful music that sounds like it’s been distilled from out of a dream. Maybe only a few people have dreams that sound like that, I don’t know, but I doubt it. Music can be as big and expansive and as far out as you want it to be you know. Because music isn’t actually about anything, it can be about EVERYTHING if you want. I think that’s what this stuff is, and that goes for all the above groups too.
2) Cardiacs are to music what semiotics is to the theory and practice of literary criticism. What do you make of that then?
Kavus
– I don’t know what that even means….is it something to do with a bare knuckle fist fight?
3) There is absolutely NO FUCKING WAY I would let a DJ or RAPPER star in a video to your song “The Duck and Roger The Horse”, what about you?
Kavus
– On the contrary I would only have a DJ or Rapper in the video, in fact…you’ve given me an idea, where did I put Snoop’s number?
4) Is it true that you have/use all the equipment that used to belong to Iron Maiden? (I’m not in the least bit bothered about this…but some of the readers may find it slightly interesting….may…I SAID)
Kavus
– I wish we did, although we do have one of their old Eddies from the Powerslave days, which we’re trying to modify to make it look like Jim. Actually we’re doing a pretty good job of it so far. He should be making an appearance on the next tour.
5) BONUS QUESTION!! What is the difference between your VERY FIRST 7″ and your last CD? Has the band moved forward in a satisfying and yet gratifying way??
Kavus
– Without a shred of a doubt, although as a fan, it’s always been unique and fucking great. When I first joined we did three nights at the Garage in London where we only played stuff from 1977-81, about 35-odd songs. A lot of those tunes had never been recorded and others only exist in the form of dodgy tapes etc, but hearing that stuff rocked-out and played through a proper big PA makes you realise what amazing tunes they are. A lot of that stuff was written when Tim was 16, but I’ll be damned if it didn’t sound like it was written yesterday. They were recorded as well them gigs, should be available this year, only from the Cardiacs website though.
6) Since the “GUNS” album, what (apart from getting that ex-Plymothian Kavus Torabi in on guitar) has happened that is NEW or exiting??? Did you enjoy the last tour with The Wildhearts?
Kavus –
The Wildhearts tour was just fantastic the entire band and crew were sweethearts from the out, but far more surprisingly The Wildhearts fans seemed to really take to us….which is not what usually happens with their supports according to Ginger or if they didn’t like us they certainly kept it to themselves. We’re in the middle of recording a new album as well at the moment. It’s gonna be very good I reckon.
7) Is it true that your bass player can perform the amazing feat of LEVITATION?
Kavus
– Yes, but when he insists on showing it to you for the umpteenth fucking time every fucking night, it stops being so amazing.
8) What has happened to the ABC intro-tape at your shows??? Where has that sexy woman’s voice gone??? (can you send me a tape of it???)
Kavus
– It’s great and all that, but the intro tape we have, which is the same one that has been used for years is about the best-damn-intro-tape-that-any-shitty-band-has-on-this-grief-ridden-planet. It would be like when they changed the music for The Bill (UK cop drama, for our American cousins) …it sucked. (plus we can’t really go against what Alphabet tell us)
9) Please explain the main functions and modus-operandi of THE ALPHABET BUSINESS CONCERN… for those not in the know.
Kavus
– Well I’m in the band, and also have been involved in the band for years, yet I feel about as “in the know” as you. I really have no idea. I know they sometimes manage to get records out and organise gigs, and I once had a message on my answerphone from someone who was once vaguely connected to them, but beyond that…fuck knows. I’m not even sure if they actually like the band. When I joined they sent me the sash that I wear on stage, with an accompanying note that said, “WEAR THIS”, but that’s been about the limit of my involvement with them so far.
10) Have Cardiacs ever been accused of looking like “VISUAL NAZIS”?
Kavus –
Visual Nazis aside, whatever they are, what’s the deal with this triple-question-mark BS? Do you want us to answer three times?
11) You have all been ordered by the HIGH COMMISSION OF SCRUFF to brutally slay two persons alive and well in the world today…WHO would it be….and WHY? (You HAVE to do this….it is a totalitarian FASCIST thing….there is NO WAY out of it…ok?)…….(Make it fuckin’ interesting mates please)
Kavus –
Is this a Heavy Metal magazine? Why is it only metal mags that ask such retarded questions, although don’t get me wrong, I’m a great lover of the genre as a whole. If you want us to make it interesting, ask a more interesting question like, “If there was a gun at your head and you HAD to either BUM a monkey or STAB a horse, which would it be?” for instance.
12) Do you miss Jon, the old guitarist? He’s a lovely man, isn’t he? Is this line up now (Jan 2005) a permanent line up or what?
Kavus –
It “feels” permanent. Everybody misses Jon of course, although I’m not sure they miss me and Jon being together in the same place *
14) What’s up with Childish Management and Mark Walmsely’s HUGE CORPORATE company? Has it sold it’s ass to Columbia or Sony yet??? (Hi Mark, Canadian Angus & Co…yes it’s me, Scruff- I’m still alive…thanks)
Kavus
– There you go with those triple question marks again.
15)What does the bright future hold for Cardiacs??? When is the NEW album gonna be out??? Please list your releases so far….for the readers…for those that know not.Please give us your website address for email contact. Also where can your readers buy your albums and merchandise?
Kavus
– Well…I’ll start with a little poem… Being primarily an obsessive fan, I’ll list all the releases as best as I can.
Singles: A Bus For A Bus On The Bus* –1979 (Released as Cardiac Arrest on Tortch Records) Seaside Treats ep There’s Too Many Irons In the Fire-1987 Is This The Life-1988 Susannah’s Still Alive- 1988 Nighttracks ep (radio sessions)- 1988 (on Strange Fruit records) Baby Heart Dirt- 1989 Day is Gone ep-1991 Bellyeye-1995 (on Org records) Manhoo- 1995 Odd Even 1996 Signs- 1999 Albums: Archive Cardiacs (compilation of first two cassettes)- 197? The Seaside-1984 Big Ship (mini album)- 1986 Rude Bootleg (live)- 1986 A Little Man and a House and the Whole World Window- 1988 Cardiacs Live-1988 On Land and In the Sea- 1989 Songs for Ships and Irons (comp feat. Big ship mini plus other singles)- 1991 Heaven born and Ever Bright-1992 All That Glitters is a Mares Nest (live)- 1995 Sampler (compilation)1995 Sing to God, parts 1&2 (Originally available as double album) 1995 Guns-1999 Greatest Hits- 2001
All albums and singles released on The Alphabet Business Concern unless listed otherwise.
_ Loads of other albums by Tim Smith, some featuring other Cardiacs too, including Mr and Mrs Smith and Mr Drake, The Sea Nymphs, Oceanland World and Spratley’s Japs._
16) You have 5 wishes….What do you wish for??? (Character check here…see if you’re all TYPICAL humans or not …I hope not and….I don’t think so)
Kavus
– Man, I’m really sorry Scruff and Rockbottom, I’m a typical human in that I’ve been doing this thing all afternoon and the creation of the universe is on the telly in half a hour and my brain hurts. Ok, World Peace, World War and Voivod to make another album as good as Nothingface There’s three.
17) Michael Moore Kiss him or KILL him??? What do you think?
Kavus –
Who gives a fuck…he’s a famous entertainer and like most famous entertainers, fairly annoying/ fairly harmless. Is he going to “change the world for good”?…About as much as a rock band are.
18) Briefly tell us Cardiacs… What do you make of the following: A) UFO’s B) Remote Viewing C) Poltergeist Phenomena D) London E) Captain Jon’s Heightened awareness and painters and decorators in general.
Kavus –
A) They’re flyin’. B) First album good, went a bit downhill after that. C) As above. D) Love it. E) He’s the un-carved block. They’re cunts, every man-jack one of ‘em.
19) Thank You Cardiacs…This is your space to say what you feel. Hope you enjoyed the interview?
Kavus
– I’m opinioned-out now. Thank you it’s been fun. xxx
Bite Me Magazine UK April 2005
Interview with Kavus Torabi
1. First things first – who, and or, what are the Cardiacs? It’s always best to get the information from the source.
K .Cardiacs are Tim Smith who sings the words and plays the SS guitar and invents the tunes, Jim Smith who thinks he plays the bass, Bob Leith who can play some drum sets and Kavus Torabi who plays guitar and is me.
2. I read on your web site that there is no middle listening ground with the band, you either love the sound or you hate it. And, having been to a gig I can declare to all readers that, seeing these guys perform live is like a religious experience (without the candles or the hard seats) So how does it feel to be creating music that has such a profound effect?
K. Well, obviously it feels amazing, especially for me, who had been ruined by this music for fifteen odd years before joining the band. Everybody involved in the band, from the faceless corporate ghosts of The Alphabet Business Concern down to the lowliest set dressers barely scraping by on a minimum wage, are duty bound by a love of the band’s strange rock tunes to serve “The Cause”.
For me, hearing ‘On Land And In The Sea’ was like a clarion call to haul my lazy refusenik butt from a twilight existence in the South West of this England all the way over to London and get on board with the rigmarole of making proper far out music.
That’s generally the case with everyone to do with the band. Such wonderful and unique music inspires a blind loyalty that to the….er, non converted seems, perhaps rightly, absurd.
3. It has been said that it is difficult to label the Cardiacs sound; do you think this is part of your appeal?
K. Not really, I’m surprised that more bands don’t make stuff that sounds like this although it takes a fairly dogged and stubborn approach to have kept the band going as long as it has. It’s a pity that there isn’t a term to describe what we do as it’s just tunes really, but when labels get applied they’re either way off the mark or just ghastly. I’m sure very few groups could accurately describe what they do and to be fair it’s not their job. I reckon if you’re stuck in an actual genre it’s a pain in the arse because to some degree you feel pressure to repeatedly come up with stuff that fulfils what that genre requires…. if that makes any sense. Cardiacs music is always instantly recognisable as Cardiacs, whether it’s a thrashing wall of noise or a few beautiful and gently creaking notes, and that’s a wonderful position to be in I reckon.
4. It certainly seems to draw in people from all sorts of cultures and background. In Cambridge there were punks and students and Goths in the same room…and they WEREN’T killing each other! Are you a force for world peace?
K. Or World War. Well, it’s folks just united by tunes. I think those “youth sub-cultures” are more about what you wear than what you listen to…I mean fancy only liking one kind of music. What a waste of ears.
5. The other weird thing about seeing you play live is that you get the distinct feeling the billing has been mixed up and the headliners have come onstage early. Don’t the other bands get annoyed, depressed, drunk that the audience is now ready to go home and spend the evening surfing the internet for Cardiacs merchandise?
K. I don’t really think that happens does it? I’m not entirely sure what this question means although I suspect it’s very flattering, so thanks.
6. Your lyrics are like Alice in Wonderland, put through a blender with some of the best poetry and darkest novels of all time – how do you come up with it/what inspires it?
K. Tim does all that mischief, I can never understand what the fuck he’s going on about when he speaks to me, let alone his lyrics. They do conjure up strong images though. Very strong. He says they are just fairy tales. I know it takes him years to come up with them.
7. So how come, when you have the most powerful, original and mind-blowing sounds out there, you aren’t driving around in chauffer driver hearses (the thinking persons choice of car) drinking the juice of freshly squeezed virgins?
K. How do you know we’re not? It’s true though, but, without wanting to sound like some kind of uber-hippy, getting to do this stuff, play this amazing music and have the friends we do is it’s own reward….really. Some more dosh would be nice though, I’d like to be able to buy another KitKat. One with FOUR fingers.
8. You also have the most active (and interactive) set. Do you need an oxygen tent when you come off stage – you must be knackered (and hot)?
K. We have been known to sweat a little in the duty of having a bloody good rock, it’s true.
9. It must take certain a type of determination to play in a suit and tie?
K. We aim to please and are told to look our best when we are out and about. I escaped lightly. The Alphabet Business Concern told me to wear a kilt. They don’t know that I haven’t done this. This worries me. They will find out.
10. Do you enjoy touring?
K. You’re darned tooting we do. It’s the most fun there is… sort of.
11. What would be your ultimate line up to play in?
K. Oh, you know, headlining Glastonbury in the rain…something like that.
12. Your music seems to influence a lot of bands; does this make you feel very proud?
K. Extremely proud and a little humbled.
13. Who or what influences your sound?
K. All sorts. And everything. Surprising really as it all comes out sounding like the same old crap
14. Are you surprised by your appeal and popularity amongst the gothic sub culture?
K. It’s reassuring to know that there still is a gothic sub culture. I miss the way that people used to paint their favourite album covers, with varying degrees of success, on the back of their leather jackets.
15. What are your favourite Cardiacs tracks?
K. I love them all, but off the top of my head….Flap Off You Beak, The Stench Of Honey, No Bright Side, Dirty Boy, Fairy Mary Mag, All His Geese Are Swans, The Breakfast Line, The Everso Closely Guarded Line, Piffol Two Times, Core, Spell With A Shell, Jitterbug, Fiery Gun Hand, Manhoo, Buds and Spawn…actually like I said, I love them all. Really though, all of them.
16. What’s next for you? Feed our need!
K. A whole bunch of stuff. By the time you read this our Special Garage Concerts CDs will be available, which are two 16 song live albums from our Special Garage Concerts a couple of years ago. We played only tunes from when the band first started in another lifetime. Strange hearing songs that were written when the band were all about 15 or 16 years old, they really don’t sound that different to what we do now. Weird bunch of 16 year olds they must have been. We’re also completing a new album and the ‘Mares Nest’ concert will be out on DVD this year plus a couple of extra special treats which at this point in time are a secret.
17. Who are what are the Alphabet Business Concern – should we be worried?
K. Not nearly as worried as we should be. As a new recruit they see me as bottom in the chain of command and, as a consequence, have very little to do with me. They once left a message for me to ring them on my answerphone, but when I returned the call all I got was a strange kind of speaking clock.
18. What would you do if you had 5 minutes to live?
K. How would you know?
19. What would you do if you came face to face with a vampire?
K. Ask them to get on with it, fuck it, it’s been a shit life anyway.
20. What is the last thing you think of before you turn out the light?
K. Boy, I sure would like to turn out this light.
21. What was the last book you read?
K. I think it was Running With Scissors by Augusten Burroughs.
22. What was the last horror film you watched?
K. Dario Argentia’s Suspiria, which is really fun and has a proggy soundtrack. A friend of mine keeps hassling me to watch Island of Death, so that will probably be the next one.
23. When was the last time you were scared?
K. Genuinely shit scared? I honestly couldn’t tell you. My mind’s on a fairly even keel at the moment.
24. Who is the last person you would like to meet in a dark alley.
K. “Nasty” Nick Bateman…he’s like evil or something.
25. What would you like you last words to be?
K. Thank you for this fun interview, hope you have a really nice time.
Sarah Kerr – Bite Me Magazine.
